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Cumulus MultiBlock Prover #2603
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I have read and hereby sign the Contributor License Agreement. |
@keeganquigley requesting your review |
Hey @MrishoLukamba , |
@MrishoLukamba sry for the delay here, we have a bit of a backlog currently. I'll review by tomorrow EOD. Thanks for your patience! |
Any updates @takahser ? |
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@MrishoLukamba Apologies, I thought I replied already here. 😅
Generally, it looks interesting. Would you mind clarifying on the following points?
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Ecosystem Demand / Fit
- Can you provide concrete examples of parachain teams or use cases that would adopt a zk-proof based validation layer?
- How do you see this complementing Polkadot’s existing shared security and para-validation model?
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Technical Feasibility
- Embedding the SP1 RISC-V zkVM into Cumulus sounds computational intense. Have you benchmarked its overhead on block production and validation?
- Can you outline what proof format will be generated (e.g. size, verification cost, latency expectations)?
- Will it be possible for para-validators tp verify proofs efficiently without significantly delaying inclusion?
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Future Plans
- You mention “realtime cryptographic proving on Polkadot SDK standalone chains.” Do you envision this becoming a maintained subsystem within Cumulus, or an optional add-on maintained by your team?
Despite of these questions, I think the application is structurally sound, so I'm going to open it up to other reviewers to avoid further delays.
Apologies for taking 5 days to reply.
With all this still the security comes from the polkadot relay chain but the securing mechanism doesnt restrict parachain teams on their computation and size of their exportation for verification. And with the experimentation paradigm exploration on polkadot ecosystem, even setting up kusama as the zk playground this can speed up the experimentation on parachains.
But I have done a demo for this: https://github.com/MrishoLukamba/succinct-summer-2.5. The proof formats can be 2, groth16 scheme and Stark, with groth16 is a constant size but for this grant will focus on STARK which scale logarithmically and its fast in verification speed. And all of this done to make sure the size of POV which is the proof should be lesser than traditional merkle proof. Future Plans Realtime proving will be focused on standalone chains, but also mid plan is to even allow parachain to produce proof from ethereum based succinct network and be secured by polkadot relay chain. But the current grant will focus on enabling N collators to split the workload and allow paralle proving. |
@takahser any follow up question? |
@takahser any updates |
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@MrishoLukamba Thx for the detailed reply.
I have a few follow-up questions:
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Ecosystem Fit / Demand
- It would help to have actual examples of parachains currently struggling with large PoV sizes or async-backing constraints. Otherwise we risk creating solutions for problems that don't exist.
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Benchmarks / Proof Characteristics
- Could you provide some numbers from your demo project that compare the current system (PoV block with Merkle-based witness data) against your proposed zk-proof system? In particular:
- Size of the data submitted (bytes).
- Time and hardware needed to generate it.
- Time required for a validator to verify it.
- A simple comparison table like this would make the potential value of your solution much clearer.
- Could you provide some numbers from your demo project that compare the current system (PoV block with Merkle-based witness data) against your proposed zk-proof system? In particular:
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Validator Impact
- How do you expect verification to fit into the current backing/approval checking budgets?
- Even if STARKs are fast, para-validators operate under tight constraints. Is it possible to show that inclusion latency won’t be negatively affected?
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Downsizing the grant
- Before the full distributed proving system, would you consider reducing this initial grant to an initial milestone that just demonstrates a zk proof replacing a PoV for a small parachain block, with logs/metrics on proof size and verification cost?
- That would derisk the complexity and give reviewers confidence in feasibility before scaling to collator distribution and aggregation.
I am preparing all the metrics, and okey we can start with the first milestone |
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